New Supplements and 30 Day Embargo

[Akaiyou]

Army Builder staff really needs to change their mind on this I am now just disappointed to see that you've given up on updating AB files just because the print version isn't available even though the digital and epub versions are around for months.

Hell download that shit if u have to, little will we care if we don't get 'reference' pages no one here and by no one i mean everyone in the fan base of AB will vote to NOT update due to lack of page reference numbers.

I, like a lot of other 40k players have resorted to using epub for these supplements due to lack of ipad. Where there is a will there is a way, I love army builder man but this right here is the type of nonsense that can lose you customers.

I've been checking AB daily for some updates on the 40k files to come in. And I am not a big fan of battlescribe for my list building, i rather pay for AB which ive been using since 2005. But if this becomes standard practice I'm afraid I am less likely to renew my subscription. For the simple fact that I tend to not even play an army i own (i own 12 40k armies) until it's on AB and i can build my list with the ease that AB provies. I've bit the bullet with Farsignt Enclave and Black Legion because of the lack of updates but with Sisters of Battle now being digital only, and blood angels rumored to be getting a digital update aswell it seems that digital is the way of the future for 40k books...and I do not want to have to wait extra months on it.

For the record i've been an avid supporter of AB recommending it to several people for years. But this new direction has struck a nerve (as you can tell by the rant) please don't force loyal fans like myself to "have" to look for alternate solutions to your great product. It's a loss for all parties

[Homer_S]

Army Builder staff really needs to change their mind on this I am now just disappointed to see that you've given up on updating AB files just because the print version isn't available even though the digital and epub versions are around for months.

Hell download that shit if u have to, little will we care if we don't get 'reference' pages no one here and by no one i mean everyone in the fan base of AB will vote to NOT update due to lack of page reference numbers.

I, like a lot of other 40k players have resorted to using epub for these supplements due to lack of ipad. Where there is a will there is a way, I love army builder man but this right here is the type of nonsense that can lose you customers.

I've been checking AB daily for some updates on the 40k files to come in. And I am not a big fan of battlescribe for my list building, i rather pay for AB which ive been using since 2005. But if this becomes standard practice I'm afraid I am less likely to renew my subscription. For the simple fact that I tend to not even play an army i own (i own 12 40k armies) until it's on AB and i can build my list with the ease that AB provies. I've bit the bullet with Farsignt Enclave and Black Legion because of the lack of updates but with Sisters of Battle now being digital only, and blood angels rumored to be getting a digital update aswell it seems that digital is the way of the future for 40k books...and I do not want to have to wait extra months on it.

For the record i've been an avid supporter of AB recommending it to several people for years. But this new direction has struck a nerve (as you can tell by the rant) please don't force loyal fans like myself to "have" to look for alternate solutions to your great product. It's a loss for all parties

Let's remember a few things here:

1) We are all volunteers.

2) We all therefore have paying day jobs and family or personal lives.

3) We have finite personal resources. Someone has to buy the book in order to adapt it to Army Builder.

4) Games Workshop/Forgeworld have essentially doubled their release rate.

5) Allies is the hardest damn mechanic to code, especially since with the elimination of Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters we just finished stripping it all out.

6) Without page references, the only footnotes are weapons profiles.

Homer

[Akaiyou]

Fair enough, but I for one cast my voting ballot in for 'no need for page references'. Players should have a codex and rulebook anyway every individual should be able to look up any relevant rules. If getting rid of page references will speed up the process of new releases so that you guys can be more able to keep up with the current release rate (let's face it lots of things are being released it will only get WORSE with time as you get backed up)

Trim down the excess fat for the sake of a happier fan base. Or at least consider it, i'm almost positive that at least 90% of the fan base is a lot more upset about waiting several months on their army to be available on AB than if they lacking some reference numbers for rules that they should have looked up or owned a codex/rulebook for in the first place anyway.

Faster releases > page references.

[andrewm9]

For those people sayong more faster, I suggest that you try building these files yourself if you want them. I know they take a lot of effort. I've spent time trying to rebuild Sisters and it isn't easy. BTW I'm not on the team but I appreciate the effort t takes having done it myself a few times. There is a lot to code in these releases and can only imagine the nghtmare of redoing space marines as I have looked at redoing it myself. I decided to wait as I don't have the time. Oh and one more thing, the team here is not associayed with Army Builder at all. These guys do this in heir own free time for no money.

[jlong05]

I love army builder man but this right here is the type of nonsense that can lose you customers.

I didn't know you have been a paying customer of ours. All this time I have been just doing this for free. 

I've been checking AB daily for some updates on the 40k files to come in. And I am not a big fan of battlescribe for my list building, i rather pay for AB which ive been using since 2005. But if this becomes standard practice I'm afraid I am less likely to renew my subscription. For the simple fact that I tend to not even play an army i own (i own 12 40k armies) until it's on AB and i can build my list with the ease that AB provies. I've bit the bullet with Farsignt Enclave and Black Legion because of the lack of updates but with Sisters of Battle now being digital only, and blood angels rumored to be getting a digital update aswell it seems that digital is the way of the future for 40k books...and I do not want to have to wait extra months on it.

What Subscription do you refer to? I thought I saw that Wolflair removed the subscritpion model recently and everyone with an existing license was given a permanent, non-expiring license. If yours was not, you might want to ring them up at http://www.wolflair.com.

For the record i've been an avid supporter of AB recommending it to several people for years. But this new direction has struck a nerve (as you can tell by the rant) please don't force loyal fans like myself to "have" to look for alternate solutions to your great product. It's a loss for all parties

And finally, as a long time user, you appear slightly mis-informed on the process, the licnse you have for AB and what that all entitles you to. I recommend a thorough review of all the FAQ literature on AB found at http://www.wolflair.com as I feel it might be truely enlightening for you.



Now, having said that to him, for all others. The simple fact is, not everyone agrees with every decision we make or even everyone agrees with the statements others make demanding changes. We cannot make everyone happy, but I know that a LARGE portion of our userbase will be upset when we remove page references. They bitched and moaned when we stopped posting the full rule info and started only giving a page ref, so I know it will be worse. While I PERSONALLY agree that everyone shoudl own their codex, many do not and feel INCORRECTLY that AB and these files are a solution to nothaving to par GWs absurd prices for rules. Unfortuantely that is incorrect and if we do move to the no page ref process, SHUDDER, that will mean these files will ONLY be usable for list creation and have no solid benefit in game play. 

This is a very REAL concern for our entire team and is the reason we have been in discussion regarding this. It has largely not been an issue until the recent Digital only Sisters release. Rest assured that we are working on a solution and are in discussion, but quite honestly the RANTS as posted are a sure fire way to alienate the entire team and have us all walk as this is simply becoming a job that I DONT get paid for, just still get BITCHED at. I have plenty of that at my REALLIFE job.

Thanks.

[Akaiyou]

Did wolflair really remove the licenses and start giving out permanent free licenses?? This must be pretty recent because I most definetly paid for mine about a year ago (been actually expecting to get those 'renew' notices at some point in the near future) so no...mine was def not free. FACT

I'm what you call an average consumer...I buy AB, seek new updated files, they had a link to this place for getting files, thus the logical conclusion is that you guys are associated in some way. Regardless of wether you want to accept this fact or not, the average consumer will indeed associate you with wolflair considering you make the files that run on their product. FACT

For the guy who commented 'try making it yourself', I infact HAVE tried making it myself midly successful with the Tyranid files from 4th to 5th ed codex. I seem to have a weird talent for learning to code things I don't know ish about. Yes it's time consuming, and difficult and eventually I ran into a brickwall when trying to do the more 'advanced' stuff and yet here i am still bitching about this decision. "Why?" you ask...simple...I paid for AB exclusively for the 40k files, and have been 'paying' this tax to an already expensive hobby for years. It's very noble that these guys do this work for free, but let's be real without the 40k updates AB would lose a huge chunk of it's base thus they should pay you. If you've never taken the time to arrange some sort of payment with them, that is not my problem, but I strongly believe you guys should get paid by the company you put in so many hours to support.

I sure as hell wouldn't ever pay for AB without the 40k files. I'm sure i can't be the only one. Charitable work is noble but really, but from a pure business point of view (I'm a business major) you guys are a golden goose for wolflair, and should be rewarded. If you ever decided to go on strike it would greatly hurt their 'business' if they still run one.

With that said, I am not bitching about the time lapse that was 'standard' with these files...raising my voice about the decision to leave out the supplements until hardcover releases. The forum is to raise concerns, comments nad suggestions no? Well then I'm using it properly by suggesting that this decision be over turned.

As you've all said, the team is debating the issue. But to say 'people complaining will alienate the team' that's the same as saying 'we're a team of spiteful people, if you complain we'll go the exact opposite way just to spite you'

Awesome so should I open a thread decrying all supplements and crossing my fingers for bigger delays in the process in the hopes that you'll treat them the same as a regular release?

I would hope not. I'm no politician but if I held the kind of power to do something as amazing as what you guys do, and the people who I do it for in the great majority requested something be it by bitching, voicing their opinions, waving around picket signs, etc. Then logically this would influence me more to give the people what they want. At least a normal non-spiteful person wouldn't try to kick rocks at their fanbase just for the sake of disagreeing with them.

Seems very counter-productive, and being that I've been with this program since '05, I know full well how productive you guys have been. I'm grateful for it. But you can't get mad when you receive complaints from your customers/fans (business major remember?) that's just part of the cake you choose to bake.

So once more for what it's worth with the very very little power if any of a single player, a droplet if the ocean if you will of what are the total number of AB users. I just want to raise my hand and vote "PLEASE DONT" to extended delays on supplements/digital releases.

That is all.

[Spack]

Did wolflair really remove the licenses and start giving out permanent free licenses?? This must be pretty recent because I most definetly paid for mine about a year ago (been actually expecting to get those 'renew' notices at some point in the near future) so no...mine was def not free. FACT

Anyone with a current license in August automatically had it switch to a non-expiring license. It was in the newsletter sent to all subscribers, and on their Facebook page. Here's a quote from the newsletter (available at http://www.wolflair.com/index.php?conte ... =july_2013 )

In recognition of Army Builder's 15th birthday, we're streamlining and simplifying how licenses work by retiring Army Builder’s license renewal mechanism. Starting on August 1st, active Army Builder licenses will no longer require yearly extensions to access program and data file updates for Army Builder 3. As of that date, all Army Builder 3 licenses that have not yet expired will forever more remain "active" and never expire.

You won't see a renew notice, because your current license won't require renewal. New Army Builder customers still need to buy a license, but there isn't a yearly renewal any more. jlong05 didn't say they were giving out free licenses, he said you won't have a subscription to renew.

[jlong05]

Did wolflair really remove the licenses and start giving out permanent free licenses?? This must be pretty recent because I most definetly paid for mine about a year ago (been actually expecting to get those 'renew' notices at some point in the near future) so no...mine was def not free. FACT

I'm what you call an average consumer...I buy AB, seek new updated files, they had a link to this place for getting files, thus the logical conclusion is that you guys are associated in some way. Regardless of wether you want to accept this fact or not, the average consumer will indeed associate you with wolflair considering you make the files that run on their product. FACT

For the guy who commented 'try making it yourself', I infact HAVE tried making it myself midly successful with the Tyranid files from 4th to 5th ed codex. I seem to have a weird talent for learning to code things I don't know ish about. Yes it's time consuming, and difficult and eventually I ran into a brickwall when trying to do the more 'advanced' stuff and yet here i am still bitching about this decision. "Why?" you ask...simple...I paid for AB exclusively for the 40k files, and have been 'paying' this tax to an already expensive hobby for years. It's very noble that these guys do this work for free, but let's be real without the 40k updates AB would lose a huge chunk of it's base thus they should pay you. If you've never taken the time to arrange some sort of payment with them, that is not my problem, but I strongly believe you guys should get paid by the company you put in so many hours to support.

I sure as hell wouldn't ever pay for AB without the 40k files. I'm sure i can't be the only one. Charitable work is noble but really, but from a pure business point of view (I'm a business major) you guys are a golden goose for wolflair, and should be rewarded. If you ever decided to go on strike it would greatly hurt their 'business' if they still run one.

With that said, I am not bitching about the time lapse that was 'standard' with these files...raising my voice about the decision to leave out the supplements until hardcover releases. The forum is to raise concerns, comments nad suggestions no? Well then I'm using it properly by suggesting that this decision be over turned.

As you've all said, the team is debating the issue. But to say 'people complaining will alienate the team' that's the same as saying 'we're a team of spiteful people, if you complain we'll go the exact opposite way just to spite you'

Awesome so should I open a thread decrying all supplements and crossing my fingers for bigger delays in the process in the hopes that you'll treat them the same as a regular release?

I would hope not. I'm no politician but if I held the kind of power to do something as amazing as what you guys do, and the people who I do it for in the great majority requested something be it by bitching, voicing their opinions, waving around picket signs, etc. Then logically this would influence me more to give the people what they want. At least a normal non-spiteful person wouldn't try to kick rocks at their fanbase just for the sake of disagreeing with them.

Seems very counter-productive, and being that I've been with this program since '05, I know full well how productive you guys have been. I'm grateful for it. But you can't get mad when you receive complaints from your customers/fans (business major remember?) that's just part of the cake you choose to bake.

So once more for what it's worth with the very very little power if any of a single player, a droplet if the ocean if you will of what are the total number of AB users. I just want to raise my hand and vote "PLEASE DONT" to extended delays on supplements/digital releases.

That is all.

Sigh...

Can someone else from the community please educate him. I am tired of the back and forth on this.

[Akaiyou]

Did wolflair really remove the licenses and start giving out permanent free licenses?? This must be pretty recent because I most definetly paid for mine about a year ago (been actually expecting to get those 'renew' notices at some point in the near future) so no...mine was def not free. FACT

Anyone with a current license in August automatically had it switch to a non-expiring license. It was in the newsletter sent to all subscribers, and on their Facebook page. Here's a quote from the newsletter (available at http://www.wolflair.com/index.php?conte ... =july_2013 )

In recognition of Army Builder's 15th birthday, we're streamlining and simplifying how licenses work by retiring Army Builder’s license renewal mechanism. Starting on August 1st, active Army Builder licenses will no longer require yearly extensions to access program and data file updates for Army Builder 3. As of that date, all Army Builder 3 licenses that have not yet expired will forever more remain "active" and never expire.

You won't see a renew notice, because your current license won't require renewal. New Army Builder customers still need to buy a license, but there isn't a yearly renewal any more. jlong05 didn't say they were giving out free licenses, he said you won't have a subscription to renew.

That's awesome, I wasn't a fan of that renewal method they had that counted backwards.
They earn +10 to customer satisfaction from me with this move.

[Commisar]

To the ranty person further up the thread:

1/ You pay for the Army builder software, not the data files. This is made abundantly clear on the lone-wolf website.
2/ No one apart from Games Workshop can make money off of Games Workshop's IP. (Or at least, if you try, you get threatened with legal action)
3/ The nice folks here at AB therefore cant take money off you, I, Lonewolf or anyone else without opening themselves up to Litigation.
4/ So Basically, that said, they are fans like you and I doing this for feel-good factor. They owe you nothing.
5/ It's a job with a massive amount of responsibility, as the rules calls in army builder really shape the game as played, and peaple get bent out of shape over things army builder does ALL THE TIME. So, you probably shouldent assume you know best what the fans of army builder want.


To the team:
1/ Thanks.
2/ Please consider making a file for Sisters of Battle, us Sisters of Battle players are much neglected by Games Workshop, I don't know how much more neglect we could take.
3/ I dont use page refrences from army builder either (if you are canvassing votes)

[shaggai]

2/ Please consider making a file for Sisters of Battle, us Sisters of Battle players are much neglected by Games Workshop, I don't know how much more neglect we could take.

The Sisters of Battle will never get neglected as long as I'm here...that's how I got started in this mess...(that being said, they'll get updated to Codex Adeptus Sororitas probably before the end of November).

[Commisar]

Thank you!

[irishlep77]

I would also like to add in my thanks for all you guys do. Knowing that I haven't taken the time to learn the underlining database to AB, I am glad there are people who do know it and update as quickly as they can. So, whenever you guys get it done, it's all good.

[Akaiyou]

To the ranty person further up the thread:

1/ You pay for the Army builder software, not the data files. This is made abundantly clear on the lone-wolf website.
2/ No one apart from Games Workshop can make money off of Games Workshop's IP. (Or at least, if you try, you get threatened with legal action)
3/ The nice folks here at AB therefore cant take money off you, I, Lonewolf or anyone else without opening themselves up to Litigation.
4/ So Basically, that said, they are fans like you and I doing this for feel-good factor. They owe you nothing.
5/ It's a job with a massive amount of responsibility, as the rules calls in army builder really shape the game as played, and peaple get bent out of shape over things army builder does ALL THE TIME. So, you probably shouldent assume you know best what the fans of army builder want.


To the team:
1/ Thanks.
2/ Please consider making a file for Sisters of Battle, us Sisters of Battle players are much neglected by Games Workshop, I don't know how much more neglect we could take.
3/ I dont use page refrences from army builder either (if you are canvassing votes)

Lol If you going to make a counter point argument...at least don't end up agreeing with the person at the end.

"Don't assume to know what others would like" "I also wanna vote to ignore the page references though"

Epic Fail sir.

[Commisar]

The diffrence is, I know how widely used and important the AB40k files are to the Global Warhammer 40,000 meta game. So I dont assume to know what the majority of the users want.

I'm quite happy to deffair to the judgement of the maintainers.

But, I happen to agree with you about the page numbers *shrug* I can see the diffrence in sentiment even if you cant.


Since we now have what we want (they are making a file for sisters, and have given a timeframe) we should probably stop bickering.